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Starting from scratch, load development
I have been waiting for good weather to do my load testing since December and today was perfect! Unfortunately I had an eye exam and couldn't take advantage 🙁
So, tonight I am organizing my thoughts and ammo to use the next weather opening. For my .223 T3 Sporter I plan to do the following:
My first load recipe will use the 75 gr A-Max (moly coated) and the new IMR 4166 with once fired ww brass neck sized (got my Lee collet mandrels in -1 and -2 thou finally since my standard one was too big). I am going to follow Erik Cortina's OCW method as described on “accurate shooters.com). Also planning a Varget OCW and the same with 80 gr SMK's.
Starting load for 75 gr A-max, and 80gr SMK's with IMR 4166 at 20 gr and max at 24+ depending on pressure signs and case capacity.
Starting Varget at 22 gr and ending at 26+ depending on pressure signs and case capacity.
I use a Frankford arsenal funnel with ~10 in. Drop tube to minimize the “crunch” on compressed loads.
I load in .3 gr increments for initial testing and use a pro-chrono chronograph to record vel.
Finally I have a bunch of JLK LD 65 gr hp bullets I want to try but that would be a big day.
Any recommendations or comments?
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13 Replies
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Starting from scratch, load development
updated 7 years, 10 months ago
5Members
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13
Replies
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Very interested in your load development with IMR 4166…I've never loaded with it so following this closely.
Knowing what I've learned over the last year playing with 75Amax and Varget I would advise not even testing on the lower end of powder charges…start about 2gr's below max published load and work up from there. My guns ( T3 Lite & T3 Varmint) didn't produce nodes with acceptable velocity till close to max pressures…You should start seeing pressure signs around 25.5grs of Varget, not sure if you'll get to 26grs without issues.
You've picked good bullets. Both have great potential for short and long range shooting especially if you keep velocity up. Both bullets really start to drop fast after 500yrds so velocity is important for extended ranges…
I'd start with a COAL of 2.45″ while working up your loads,…once you find something that looks good start pushing it closer to the lands to see where its shines the best.
***On the last batch I loaded with Varget, I used an old vibrating tooth brush to settle the powder and it really helped with the compressed load, and it even stabilized the seating depth…the previous compressed loads would expand from 2.45 to 2.46+ no matter what I did if it sat for days before I fired them. Vibrating the cases worked great to cure this issue.***
GOOD LUCK…
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Hey Dog, great advice and thanks for saving me some time. I too have used my sonicare toothbrush to settle powder charges, the drop tube seems to work ok inlieu.
How do you determine how much “crunch” is too much on compressed loads?
As far as coal, I have mags that let me load out to 2.6 or so, but I will seat bullets to 10 thou off the lands for testing.
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I measure COAL for “every” round when I'm loading for accuracy…I don't skip one.
I use my calliper to let me know if I'm compressing the loads too much. As soon as I start getting “non” uniform OAL's I know I can't control what is happening every time I push a bullet into the case so I back off. I don't play with die bushings for neck tension so I also watch for expansion days after loading is complete. As mentioned, overly compressed loads would expand and increase the COAL when sitting on the shelf so thats another sign to watch for. Don't let the crunch scare you though, You gotta get a lot of powder in that case to push the heavies with good velocity.
You'll be into the lands before you get to max out that mag you have…most guys I know of are well into the lands before they reach 2.5″ COAL. I hunt with my rifles so I always stay .030 or more off the lands on all load develop. Don't want to be in the field and take the chance of separating a round in the rifle by jamming it on the lands or having issues chambering if any of the rounds expand.
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Hey Dog, not sure I'm clear on what you mean.
Do you mean that when you start getting variable oal's you know your over compressing?
I plan to use the same neck sizing setting for each round (using the “consistent crimp” torque handle) and Lee collet die. Seating bullets with forster micrometer seating die.
All cases will be 2nd fireing and neck sized with the Lee die. In other words I fired the new cases with 23.9 gr benchmark and 52 gr bthp moly and rem 7.5 primers. I will anneal for next loading. I mean 3rd loading which will not be part of testing
K reread your last post and think you meant “non” uniform coal. I hear that and depending on neck tension that should be a good measure. Since neck tension cannot get much above 2 thou due to nature of brass, variable oal over bullet vagaries should be good measure of over compressed loads.
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Forster micrometer seating die…Thats a kick ass die…you are well on your way to some accurate loading.
Sounds like you have a good plan of attack. Looking forward to your report from range test.Correct…Meant “non” uniform…I corrected the typo above.
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In my experience on this forum, Eric doesn't mess around. I picked up a Redding competition set with a bushing style neck sizer and micrometer seating die. It mentions not compressing loads, so I won't be able to do that. Haven't been able to use it yet since I don't actually HAVE a rifle in that caliber though. Still waiting on the new barrel which won't be till late summer.
I was going to seat my 7mm 180 Berger Hybrid Targets a couple thousands off the lands and generally play around with it to see what works best. Looking forward to Robert announcing the new longer bottom metal with 3.6″ COAL availability. I think he said June. IMO, June can't come fast enough.
As far as powders, I've seen the 4166 and new Enduron line from IMR. I've got a bottle of 7977 waiting for a 695 in 6.5-06 to get back from the smith. Apparently when it was done 20 odd years ago, the smith didn't know too much about the cartridge and never polished the chamber. We've had tool marks on all brass and it's been a bear to get some rounds to extract. We're hoping it's just a simple chamber polish, and not a set back 1/8 inch and re-ream job.
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What is your intended use, hunting or punching paper?
80 gr VLD's hammer in the 8 twist. That's what I shoot in my Super Varmint in F-TR competition. Never could get the A Maxes to shoot in mine.
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Any update?
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Sorry no update yet, but I have worked up my excell spreadsheets to set up the basics.
I am a crop consultant (small fruit, including apples) and we are busy right now. I currently have 2 days at home before i have to go to Minnesota and work with the apple clients. I am loading my ammo tomorrow to bring with me to the MN, Detroit Lakes range. I have my chargmaster full of IMR4166 and I set my Forster micrometer seating die at .010 for 75 gr A-Max. I have to load like 70 rounds to cover the entire range, asuming i will have to pull some on the high end … gah lots to to!!!
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Hey Yukonal, I have access to hunting shack near Hettinger ND, and last year I and my buddies set up some steel targets at various ranges. we shoot pheasants every year, and I set up some targets using my gps last year. We did not get to shoot since i got sick and we were working on cabin. Next year … we are going to do some serious shooting!
Anyway, I am going to fix up our “range” (since I am close like 4 hrs) and get some real world experience on long range shooting. I will take pics and since North Dakota insists on crazy early application (like june) , I hope to get a tag for a buck.
About 45 minutes from our pheasant hunting location, appears to be a prarie dog range…. I plan to scout the area this summer and hope to find some good towns to set up on.
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If wind isn't a problem, you can stretch that Sporter out. Always amazes me what a well built .223, and a steady hand can do. No wind, and 600 is boring with my Super Varmint.
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No data yet, (sigh)just got back home and got to go again in couple days. Wind was close to 30mph even if I was all set up. Will keep you posted.
Thanks for the props Asgen, but there are folks on this site with way more exp than me, including Yukonal, Larkin and Dogdown to name a few!
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I finally got my head cleared out enough to post a few comments…
My experience with 75 amax's has shown them to be very sensitive to seating depth (they're VLD's if you ask me). If I give them a 20 thou jump, they group .86 moa. If I kiss the lands (2.494″ in mine), they group .45 moa.
Jason has found the 80.5 Bergers to be much more forgiving.
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